I have a problem with my line. There is a division in it, half want to listen, act normal, and play corps-style. The other half won't listen, have bad attitudes, hack constantly, and just all around don't want to cooperate with the rest of the line. The real problem is that we are going to start recruiting soon and I don't want all of the incoming freshman to think that they can come in next year and do no work and expect it to be ok. What can I do to fix this rift between my line members and get us all on the same page?

could always make an example of them. but that could jsut make a bigger problem. I would say try and keep them busy enough where they dont have the chance to hack around and goof off. if you have to stop to sratch your nose have them do 8 on a hand. do anything to keep them busy. If they dont lke it then tell them to drop.

Lots and lots of discipline. I know exactaly what you're going through. There was this freshman/rookie on our drumline two years ago that hacked all the time, had a bad attitude, talked so much stupid <beep>, and even used my own girlfriend (now my ex) on me when ever i yelled at him. But, as soon as i broke up with her, my main focus was on him. So, it would be like everday in class, i would literally have to hurt him (they were use to it), but not as if i was trying to start a fight. Then, i made him play with the orchestra for concert season. The discipline really helped, even though i took some of it too far. Right now, he's probably the band's best percussionist. So, my advice to you would be USE DISCIPLINE ON YOUR DRUMLINE. If all else fails, talk to your band director about their behavior.

I have same problem

discipline them to heck and back. if they don't want to cooperate, tell them to quit. it is better to have a small focused line than a huge line that jacks around the whole time. as for the newbies comin in, they are all going to fit in where they want to. if they want to play, they'll play. if they want to be stupid, they'll be stupid. it's just people's personalities. you just have to make it known that you are the authority and that you won't be tolerating their crap.

do you have grades based on playing your music for the show? if so, it will definitely show who isn't participating properly in sectional rehearsal. also, as section leader (at our school anyways) you would have the authority to just tell them to leave sectionals.

in my opinion, if you dont want to be in band, you shouldn't keep coming. tell them that. if they don't want to be there, stop coming. end of story.

I assume from your e-mail you don't have a full time perc person to help crack the whip here. For what it's worth, I've dealt with this issue time and time again in teaching several high school lines, and the bigger problems have been corrected every time, usually within the first four rehearsals. You still do need to watch out for the attitudes / hacking reappearing later on in the season even if these people do change their ways early on though.

Here's what seems to work for me in the past:

1) You need to talk openly with the "good" half of the line, privately to make sure all of you are commited to making things better and how to best fix the problems. If you do not have their support, and get their commitment to stick with you on this, I'm afraid you'll be in a battle you cannot win in just one season - so verify their support and get their ideas so that this is about all of your wishes to make things better, and how to go about it, and not just yours.

2) Define with the "good" half what needs to happen and make this a policy, but try and do this by including the whole line, not just the "good" half or it may further divide the line. In other words, a policy may be, if you are caught hacking you will...run laps, clean up the band room, and so on. Peer pressure CAN be a good thing if it's used in the right way. If someone hacks and is expected by everyone to run two laps for instance and he/she doesn't do it, that person knows they will be isolating themselves further from the group, and chances are will run the laps to prevent this. You need a direct consequence for everyone for bad behavior, including yourself if certain unwanted actions take place.

3) Lead by example - you and the good half, if you expect everyone to live by the ground rules you need to, too. Nobody listens to a hypocrite.

4) If you can, try and keep your Director informed what's going on. If you can get his / her support you will find your efforts that much more successful since realistically your director can drop grades and ultimately kick people out if needed if they are just not coming around. Do not try an use authority that you really don't have, people will see through it, and will not respect what you say thereafter.

5) Make your changes positive and do your best to refrain from freaking out, yelling, or talking down to the "bad" group. Help them understand that being in the line is a choice, and you are there to help them and the line, but by being in the line there is a certain expectation involved. Hopefully, over time the "bad" half will see that the decision to do this is up to them, and will not see you as the enemy who is hassling them. They ultimately should rethink why they are in this activity, and realize they are in full control over their actions. By doing what is expected they will remain a part of the line, and by not doing what they are supposed to be, they are choosing to be dismissed from the line. Again, you will probably need to get someone who really has this authority to back you on this, because empty threats will get you nowhere.

If you do this, over time, you will probably lose a few people (some bad ones) who will either quit, which may not be a bad thing or will get kicked out, which will send a message to the others that the behavior in the past will not be tolerated any more and that there are real, immediate, consequences for their actions.

If you and the good half put together a plan and stick with it, adjusting the plan as needed along the way, you WILL turn around the line - but don't expect it to happen overnight; it will take time.

Well what you can do is if they happen to mess up give them more practice time after the rehersal. They might as well take the punishment that way. Sometimes push ups do not work.
For example:
This past year my section which is the pit had a real attitude problem. My section leader didn't know what to do. She asked me for advice since I was the veteran in the pit. I told her that for everytime they messed up the whole line would stay after for a couple of minutes. That worked for me so it may work for you too.

That's like over here. the snares are always talking and being rude. the instructor was like things have to change here and was saying if we don't get things done we'll have more practices. but his words didnt do anywork. then the last practice the other instructor was leading, because the main one was out, was like stop it you guys are being really rude and I don't like that. He then focused on the pit since apparently they weren't ready. And the snares stopped. Or it could have been because the drum capt was in a really bad mood and people listen to her so when she says something people listen. Try getting the person whom you know everyone will listen to and get them to stop the bad half

Hey thanks for all your help guys. Hopefully we can get all of this stuff worked out.